Gram Parsons in the Country Music Hall of Fame? You're kidding, right?

Wow. The post is still here but the 28+ pages of comments have been.... deleted?

Over 3,000? Now over 12,000 and counting.

Just for the record, Jim Bouton should be in the Hall of Fame, along with Eddie Gaedel and other baseball greats...

And Barry Bonds should not....


Having had season tickets for years right behind where Barry played in left field....I would agree with you.

What about Pete Rose?

 If you're gonna ban Rose for life for gambling you sure can't let in Bonds, Sosa, McGuire, etc.  Ever.

He bet on games he thought his team would win. I can't see Rose ever betting against himself.




Have to disagree guys.  Bonds and McGuire should be in the HOF.  They were injesting products that weren't specifically banned at the time to gain an edge.  The same way Mike Schmidt and Hank Aaron were injesting "greenies" in the 60's and 70's to gain an edge.  Just as Gaylord Perry and Whitey Ford were doctoring baseballs to gain an edge. 

In fact, many feel the decline in offensive production in MLB has more to do with the lack of amphetamines than steroids. Of course my mindset is since I pay a lot of money to get entertained when I see professional sports, I say give them all the pills they want to make them jump higher and run faster.   

Pete Rose bet on baseball.  That destroys the sanctity of the game a lot more than trying to gain an egde.  It is a cardinal sin and he should never be included.

If we are going to include Bouton in the HOF, Hal, can we include wife swappers Mike Kekich and Fritz Peterson?  The NY Daily News has the orginial article from this week in 1973 on their website. 

How about A-Roid?

But for me, the best thing about baseball is the beer.

Depends on the park.

let's not forget Spaceman Lee, the original inventor of Cosmic American Baseball....


Oh funny! Bill "The Spaceman" Lee has pitched games here in San Rafael, CA for our little minor league team the Pacifics. If I'm not mistaken, I think he's the oldest playing pitcher in history (or something). But getting back to music, I also book the national anthems for that team and the Sonoma Stompers, so if you know of any Norcal singers who want to do it (they need to send me me video or audio link proving they can), then have them contact me at shelley [at]


hey shelley, there's a group (or was, I think they're still around) in Sonoma called The Ruminators, who are pretty good - you might want to check them out and see if they're feeling patriotic and sports-minded...

Thanks - I've heard of them. But please have them contact me if they are interested. I find it's too time consuming to chase people down :-). I do have tons of spots to fill though!

I'll have my people get on it...

Thank you! Seriously though, I do have lots of games to fill. They just need to send me a little proof. I've even had people sing to me over the phone!

Nomination Proposal to the CMA to Induct Gram Parsons Into the Country Music Hall of Fame

The following was written to CMA criteria and submitted as hard copy with List of Supporters to the CMA, 9/19/08, on the 35th anniversary of Gram's death and is made available to them updated 24/7 online.

 Basic Standard A

Candidate basically is to be judged on the degree of his/her contribution to the advancement of Country Music and on the indelibility of his/her impact.

Cecil Ingram Parsons III (Gram Parsons) meets this

standard unquestionably, arguably advancing country music more than any

other individual or force within that past 40 some years. His indelible impact

can be seen and is seen in the broad scope of all types of country music today.

His contributions, from the International Submarine Band's "Safe at Home"

(which many critics consider to be one of the great country albums of all time,

and is included in the Library of Congress collection as such),

his work with the Byrds during which he literally hijacked a rock band to

further his country vision with "Sweetheart of the Rodeo" (upon its release he

played the Grand Ole Opry, a milestone the Opry itself marks as being 33 in

their top 80 Opry Moments of All Time), through the groundbreaking "Gilded

Palace of Sin" and his two albums completed with his protégée Emmylou

Harris, "GP" and "Grievous Angel." It should be noted that Ms. Harris herself

on numerous occasions credits Gram Parsons for her understanding of and

distinguished career in country music and her own well deserved induction into

the Country Music Hall of Fame. Please see the comments of well over 12,000

individuals so far comprising the List of Supporters (attached and at for further substantiation of this observation.

Individual Candidacy Only

Individuals may be elected to the Hall of Fame. Companies, publications, radio stations and other groups many of which significantly foster Country Music are not eligible for Hall of Fame recognition.

Gram Parsons, although he worked with many distinguished musicians,

including those mentioned above, members of the Flying Burrito Brothers, and

Elvis Presley's backup band, is presented here for individual consideration as a

country artist; moreover, it is his singular individuality upon which this

nomination is based.

Scope of Activity Flexible

Authority is vested in the Electors in identifying the scope of a candidate's activity in Country Music. The individual may have excelled in a narrow, specific sphere . . . such as songwriting, publishing, musician, recording artist, etc. or may have been active in several areas. In any event, a candidate must have achieved definitive leadership in his/her own field of Country Music activity. However, it is definitely not mandatory to honor the leaders in every activity related to Country Music. A candidate truly must compete with all candidates in all fields, as well as with all candidates in his/her own field.

I cannot imagine a field of endeavor within country music within which any

individual can claim greater and broader excellence than that of Gram

Parsons, a scope which encompasses brilliant country songwriting, plaintive

and uniquely evocative voice, excellent musicianship on several instruments,

and as a leader, his artistic vision compelling others to help him achieve his

steadfast objective: to promote country music and bring it squarely into the

next century without turning his back on innovation in

the era in which he lived, which often was a divisive and turbulent time. He sought

with gentle kindness, good humor, wit and his art to allow those who would not

otherwise "see the light" to have it shine on them brightly.

Span of Influence

The time factor of a candidate's impact on Country Music is completely flexible. It may cover an uninterrupted span of many years or it may cover two or more distinct and separated time cycles. Conceivably, even a candidate may earn Hall of Fame recognition by one transient act, momentary in time, providing the impact on Country Music is deemed significant enough. Longevity of involvement with Country Music, therefore, will not in itself warrant recognition in the Hall of Fame.

In addition to his own history-altering achievements on the field of country

music, Gram Parsons had a profound and now widely recognized influence on

others that continues to this day. More than any other artist of the late 60s and

early 70s, Gram brought a new audience to a deep, genuine, and

transformational appreciation of authentic country music. Ironically, his

direct influence has actually had as great a longevity, if not greater, than any

nominee considering by your distinguished board over the years. I know of no

one in the past 40 years whose influence has actually grown and continues to

grow to span the decades and to have as broad an impact on country music

than Gram Parsons.

Influence on Others

A most significant criterion in evaluating a candidate will be his/her inspirational effect on others . . . the degree to which he/she multiplies his influence through others to create impact on Country Music far beyond his/her own direct individual contribution.

Gram Parsons had an exponential influence on those of his time and those in

the 38 years that he's been gone. The best testament to this are the comments

attached from all over the world, for indeed his influence was arguably more

global in spreading the gospel of genuine American country music throughout

the world than any other country artist in history (again, please reference the

List of Supporters and their countries of origin, also at

Quantity vs. Quality

A candidate's ability to expand the popularity of Country Music is a quantitative virtue. The professionalism of his/her activity is a "qualitative" one. Both quantitative and qualitative criteria are to be considered equally and separately important; conceivably, one may be present without the other.

It is the opinion of this nominator that the Latin word versus should not be used

in the above criterion. Substitute "and." The key words in this criterion are "a

candidate's ability to expand the popularity of country music" as a quantitative

virtue. Many country stars come and go, some even selling millions of

records. But how many of them leave an indelible mark on the dispersion of

country music to new audiences and expand its reach to any great extent? One

who did and continues to is Gram Parsons. An excellent reference for this is

the 12,000+ List of Supporters and their comments. I was amazed as someone who

loved Gram's music back when he was with us that so many, seemingly most,

have discovered him recently and express their reverence for his music and

wish to emphasize how it has influenced their own style of country. Then there

are the tribute songs written about him, said to total more than about any other

musician. And the number of books and movies about someone who died at 26 put

him in the same group as Anne Frank, King Tut, and Robert Johnson. While difficult

to quantify with any precision, the numbers of "units" sold since his death has

increased exponentially. There is little to add, except to say that any number

of expert lists, books and reviews put the five albums in particular listed in

the first criterion at the top of influential and both quantitative over the

years, and qualitative excellence far above most others.

Devotion to Others

Furthering Country Music by selfless devotion to the interests of others may enhance the candidacy of an individual, but it is not essential to winning. The activities of a candidate may be completely self devoted and still be considered significant enough to warrant recognition.

Perhaps the most striking example of Gram's selfless devotion to others is a

letter he wrote from Harvard, one of many, to his little sister Avis, for whom he

felt responsible after the death of both parents due to alcoholism. Please

reference David Meyer's biography (page 163) or other source for this letter,

which is as exquisite in its thought, feeling and artistry as any of his songs. All

who knew Gram knew of his personal devils (a major theme of country music),

but they also attest to his humanity and devotion to those he loved. Again, a

good source who has backed this up many times on the record is Ms. Emmylou

Harris, as well as the likes of Bonnie Bramlett ("Gram was also a catalyst among

fellow musicians. He spread the word. He was our buddy...") and many, many others.

Professional Conduct and Image

A candidate is expected to have practiced the highest caliber of professional conduct in order to enhance the public image of both himself/herself and Country Music.

All of the foregoing attest to Mr. Parsons' caliber of professional conduct. All

who knew him attest to the degree to which he had grown, both personally and

professionally, during the making of those brilliant final albums. His music

represents a desperate though controlled attempt to bridge the abyss that had

formed in the 60s and early 70s. He would preach the truth of country music to

anyone who would listen, and often did. He would walk into an otherwise

dangerous bar in the valley and win over the most hardcore of traditional

country fans. He proudly wore the same suits as Mr. Porter Wagoner, not

ironically, but out of a deep respect for the music he loved (indeed, he was one

of Mr. Nudie's best friends). Had he lived, he would have continued to enhance

the public image of country music as many of his proclaimed followers have.

Personal Morals and Behavior

The selection process is not a judgment of personal morals and behavior, providing the latter do not negatively affect the professional conduct of the candidate and the public image of Country Music.

No one will ever know what definitively happened that night 38 years ago just as

no one will know all the details of New Year’s Day 1953. Gram Parsons lived in an

undeniably divisive time, a world between the worlds.

As has been stated, everyone knew Gram had his devils. As his beloved Louvin Brothers

said, "Satan Is Real." But I am not going to simply write off this criterion by

pointing to an equally great country music legend who died a tragic young

death fighting his devils. Recent science has shown that addiction is also real,

and is caused by a defect in a gene. Both of Gram's biological parents were

extreme addictive personalities clearly demonstrating this genetic abnormality

(again, see Meyer's biography and others). True, the era he had no choice but

to live in didn't help, but to judge Mr. Gram Parsons negatively based on an

addictive behavior would not only rule out Hank, Sr., but also many other

country music notables by using a prejudicial criterion clarified by modern

science. No, Gram Parsons believed wholeheartedly in his art, in country music, in

what William Faulkner called the only thing worth writing about: the human

heart in conflict with itself.


Go ahead and keep up the baseball talk; while this "discussion" had thousands of views as Ning, with mostly supporters of the Petition to Induct, it had three the other day. Now 100 new views.

I just don't have time either, Shelley, sorry. I don't know them, just know of their work. No problem if you're too jammed to reach out, too, it was just a thought. 

This has been fun but it's also indicative of what's become of discussions and frankly historical record with the "newgrass" remaking of No Depression. Grant Alden was co-editor of No Depression magazine, and while his original post remains, the 30-some pages of comments were deleted. While the discussion got intense, it was example of what this site no longer is. But perhaps the worst crime is the destruction of a historical document, one that could have been of extreme interest when looking back on the history of not only No Depression, but the alt country movement as a whole. Shame on you newgrass.

This conversation was always ridiculous, anyway, and was just trolling readers. He's already in the Country Music Hall of Fame by way of his Nudie suit and other paraphernalia, so obviously they don't feel he's not supposed to be there.

No NOT in the Country Music Hall of Fame, just the Museum which has nothing to do with the Hall of Fame. It's the Country Music Hall of Fame® and Museum. Unlike Emmylou and the others he has no plaque in the Hall and was not inducted. Yet.